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All Kill?
Posted: Thu Jun 18, 2009 10:14 pm
by Mr.T
Since I've come back to this shard I've noticed that "all kill" doesn't work anymore. If this is an era accurate change than stop me right now and don't read the rest.
What I heard was that tamers would just pvp with "all kill" and it was really cheap, not saying it's a fact. If this is the case, what has changed? Tamers will just set a macro for a kill, b kill, c kill and it will be just as fast as all kill. The only thing this change did was make hunting for tamers very inconvenient.
So please if this is an inaccurate change please change it back?
Re: All Kill?
Posted: Thu Jun 18, 2009 11:31 pm
by Mirage
Your buddy hemporer has all the info on this topic.
Re: All Kill?
Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 12:14 am
by Hemperor
Hemperor wrote:After many weeks of trying to get the 99 "Professions: Tamer" on archived stratics to show up (over 10+ dates), I finally got frustrated. It must be the one page that never shows up.
Anyways, I decided to go forward a bit, the earliest one that works is June 13, 2000. The link is here:
http://web.archive.org/web/200006131856 ... atics.com/
If you scroll down a bit and take a look at the list of commands, you will notice that "all kill" simply isn't listed. Rather, it is listed as:
"(Name) kill",
"(Name) attack"
Attacks targeted being (doesn't work with 'All').
Some things to note. The 'All' prefix does not work all that well nor all that consistently. Sometimes 'all' the pets will obey and sometimes not. 'All follow me' works well enough if your Lore is high enough; same for 'All guard me'. 'All Attack' will cause the nearest to you to respond even if you yell the command (which I recommend). It works better if you explicitly name the tame you want to attack. On the other hand, 'All Release' will release the last tamed (or nearest); repeating the 'All Release' command will release the next most recently tamed and so on; but the 'All Attack' command doesn't that way.
Now I understand this is UO:R, very early at that, and simply looking through the patchnotes from T2A all throughout UO:R and not receiving any notification of a change on "All Kill" should be enough to put the nail in this coffin, however I like Kefka so much I will continue.
The June site doesn't offer as much information as the next dates do, or isn't as clear. Here is another quote from
December 2000. There is probably an earlier date that says it exactly in these words (the others hint it, it just isn't in as much detail) however I am far too tired to search every stratics date:
The "All" prefix does not work for orders that require a target, because only the pet closest to you will respond. It works better if you explicitly name the tame you want to issue a command for
This explains further how the "all" prefix to commands work. We know for sure that all kill functioned in some sort of way in T2A, this explains it.
It also explains why "all kill" isn't listed in this 99 patch note, among other
targetable commands ("all fetch", "all attack" etc.)
You can now give all your pets orders by prefacing your order with "all." For example, saying, "all follow me" will make all your pets follow you. The list of commands this works with is:
* all follow me
* all guard me
* all come
* all stay
* all guard me
* all stop
You will notice that NO targetable commands are listed with "all" because they just don't work the same way.
Re: All Kill?
Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 4:38 am
by tekai
I was a tamer as my main charecter, and I know for a fact all kill worked.
There was a reason people would make fun of tamers being "All Kill, No Skill"
If it didnt work, why was that a phrase? a common one at that.
I guess it appears it was changed at some point in t2a as the 00 patch notes above confirm.
seems all the fun stuff in t2a was at the begining / middle.
oh well.. yay for preuor shard.. im having fun here =)
Re: All Kill?
Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 4:46 am
by tekai
Looking for sources out of bordom.
http://uo.stratics.com/thb/info/newthunter.shtml
Talks about making a treasure hunter in 99, and making an all kill macro to "stick um all on the same monster at the same time"
http://uohoc.stratics.com/logs/2000-06-05-uocc.shtml
This ones going out on a limb, but talks about the napa valley "all kill no skill" song.. they made a song about it people...
http://boards.stratics.com/showthread.php?p=1277805
Pvp thread on Senoma.. posted Recently.. does this mean it still works on live servers today?
http://www.uoherald.com/guide/guide.php?guideId=32
Heres another one that talks about it working to this day
Oh well, guess when something beats hally mages... its gotta be nerfed!
Re: All Kill?
Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 7:43 am
by Mirage
It's not until June 2000 that you found patch notes stating that all kill does not work as a command anymore and that's halfway through the year. That's pretty far past our cutoff date. You state that all kill is NOT on the 1999 patch notes but maybe that's because it was already available as a command and didn't need to be further re-iterated. Tekai found some pretty good links if you read through them, and my memory in this situation remembers all kill working also.
Re: All Kill?
Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 8:22 am
by Faust
The "all kill" command works just fine... It just doesn't work for every pet on the screen. People that PVP'd with WW's and Dragons in t2a still used "all kill" to make them attack. Using that command was just more convenient than changing the macro to add a specific pet name. The stories involving "all kill" was generated based on people using that command to kill people in PVP with pets. Trying to base that around sending dozens of pets as a fact is stupid and pointless... The "all" command was removed completely in early UOR. However, all target commands were on an individual basis during the t2a era.
Re: All Kill?
Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 12:26 pm
by tekai
Where are your sources faust?
I was a tamer, I think you were a hally mage...
All kill was not only the closest one. Tamers are "Fine" by your standard only becuase you dont die to them atm....
Tamers killed hally mages in t2a end of story. and all kill worked. god... going back to looking for sources. im gonna find the holy grail on this one.
I may have gotten beat on the paralize becuase it was taken out in May 99 (1.5 years into the 2 year livespan of t2a) but this one ill fight tooth and nail for.
Re: All Kill?
Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 12:33 pm
by Faust
Ask Kaivan.. I didn't research taming....
I'm simply restating the results of the information that was researched awhile back.
Re: All Kill?
Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 12:35 pm
by tekai
and that research is mearly that "all kill" wasnt listed on the updated tamer commands...
that means it didnt work!? right? Right?
I'm gonna find this one.. google for once dont let me down.
Re: All Kill?
Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 12:41 pm
by Faust
Well if you actually read the entire portion it clearly states from many articles that "all" doesn't work for targetting except for the pet closest to you. It must also be one huge coincidence that none of the targetting commands are listed on there too... Right?
Trust me you won't find anything because Kaivan's research is pretty concrete...
Re: All Kill?
Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 12:41 pm
by tekai
New Source List... ill edit if i find something very formal... otherwise im gonna keep posting the million times its mentioned all over the internet.
http://uo.stratics.com/content/professi ... view.shtml
This link shows it worked during trammel... althought it didnt go into detail about the amount of pets you were allowed in that time.. what was it 3? 5?
working~
Re: All Kill?
Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 12:42 pm
by tekai
Yes, in 2000 faust.. after they took anyway everything from tamers. Trammel took away our pet limits ect... I quit over the taming changes in UOR.
Re: All Kill?
Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 12:48 pm
by Kaivan
When looking at the stratics archive of the taming guide, while its archive date is out of era, the information contained within the guide itself is dated from late 1999. This is noted by the fact that in the guide itself it mentions the patch which unified all creatures under veterinary (11/23/99), but it also mentions a tactic for transferring animals to players without taming (release and re-tame by other player) several times within the guide as a function of the era. That particular functionality was removed with the 1/24/00 patch, and indicates that the guide would have likely been written at some time during December 1999. So, while the first working archive of the information is from June 2000, the information contained within that particular archive is dated from late 1999.
Re: All Kill?
Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2009 12:50 pm
by tekai
So you want me to keep looking for sources then.. is that what you mean by that keivan? this isn't unreachable if i can find proof?
his is noted by the fact that in the guide itself it mentions the patch which unified all creatures under veterinary (11/23/99), but it also mentions a tactic for transferring animals to players without taming (release and re-tame by other player) several times within the guide as a function of the era. That particular functionality was removed with the 1/24/00 patch
Many many many things were taken away from tamers in early 00. all kill was probably one of them, i don't know, but when i couldnt have my flock of dragons i quit and went to siege!
There can't be many of us on the server that were accually tamer mains.. they took all of your time. I was though, and I KNOW i didnt spam all kill... i was much more controlled then that, becuase i remember conversations with my friends about how controlled a tamer i was. I wish i was better at internet archive?
can anyone elce help? I know no one wants to help tamers, but were not all pk gankers... but I know they protected me from pks when i told them to all kill... once.