Whats the deal with PvP
Posted: Fri May 01, 2009 12:39 am
I was curious what everyones problem is with the various styles of PvP. I am probably one of the least PvPing people on the shard, with the exception of Wise, and some of the other Crafter/PvM'ers, although I do have a Macer-Tank still in training. in any case, taking a look at it from an outside point of view, I see a few common templates.
You have the Tank mages using various weapons, even archery. They suffer from low dex, but make up for it by utilizing the 2 second re-equip swing and by holstering some of the most packed Total-Refresh stuffed backpacks I have ever seen.
Then there are the pure dexers, it seems that the most productive have some form of magery and make use of poisoned weapons. Some have Parry, some even have the poisoning skill to re-apply poison while moving. The current downfall as I understand it is the sometimes inability to kill someone before they recall, as the swing timer does not advance while moving.
Finally there is another catagory, that we used to call hybrids back on osi. I hear it called medi-dexer here however. These are like normal, bandaid-using, dexers, but they are also users of Magery coupled with Meditation, and I have seen some with eval, but that doesnt seem common. They tend to have only enough mana to cast a couple of Greater Heals at once.
It looks like a classic game of rock-paper-scissor from my standpoint. Equally played, Tank mages should have the upper hand on Dexers, as the dexer cannot heal quickly, and the capability of the tank to put out high damage in a small amount of time is damaging. Toss in the poison spell, and they become extremelt potion-reliant, at least until they run out of potions and possibly die from missing too many times in a row.
The Dexer has a clear advantage over the Medi-dexer. Armor reduces or eliminated the medi's mana regeneration rate, so naturally they sport little or none. The dexer can interupt the medi-dexer while he/she casts, due to the lack of wrestling. Without the ability to cast, the medidexer is quite defenseless to a fast weapon, that is likely poisoned, and they also lost a great deal amount of damage vs an opponent with parry.
The medi-dexer however, can be the crux of the Tank mages. They have endurance, they can keep swinging on a tank mage and interupt their 2-second weapon hits, while being able to heal, supplimented by bandaids, an ability not typical on the straight-dexer. Naturally, as they rely on casting heal/cure/debuff spells, they are likely to keep one precasted, in the same way a tank would have explode or something cast.
Here is what I am curious about. If a dexer attacks a Tank Mage and sticks to them using attack-last, they get ousted as using poor tactics, even if they are victorious. A medi-dexer, whos template is created around pre-casting heal, will be criticized substantially for pre-casting the very heal that may deem him victorious. The tank mage, can be ousted for using either one of those tactics as well.
The three major templates there all have a weapon skill. Fencing is common with poisoners but seems to suffer from a low magic-weapon drop. Swords is popular because of the speed of the katana, as well as the high damage of the hally, plus they are poisonable. Macing, deals out some low damage numbers, but the speed and damage over time of the quarterstaff are great, and the stamina-draining effect can be devestating. Archery, is very slow, due to it's lack of insta-refresh, but can be greay on a dexer for a killing blow, or for a tank mage that roams in a group.
The rules of PvP.
Ok, so you cannot pre-cast heal. Ok, well why not?? It's okay to precast and hold explode, but not heal? I understand this makes fights long and drawn out, but this is clearly biased agains medi-dexers and other defensive playstyles.
No poison or potions allowed...
Ok, well the dexer is screwed for the most part then, unless they sport some magery, there is a good chance the floor will be wiped with them.
..except for Red Pots.
WHAT? Ok, so your saying, a heal potion, that a dexer relies on, cannot be used, but a red potion, that a tank mage would NEED to survive agains a macer of any sort are completely okay? Even though the tank chose to have such a low amount of dex, directly effecting his stamina to begin with? How does that work?
Clearly all of these strategies, have some distinct advantages. A tank mage had better kill a macer before their stamina runs out, a dexer had better do a great job of staying on top of a tank mage/mage or else they risk being destroyed by a Hally-swingin-fastcast-parade, and a medidexer would be lucky to even kill someone with such a low damage output, and while poisoning and macing helps, they cannot re-apply poison and will run out of weapons, and opponents can defend agains the mace-stamina loss.
It all seems logically even from this standpoint, but the rules of "PvP" are completely in favor of the Tank Mage. Why is this?
I'm not trying to make a bash against tank-mages, or any other styles of play. (Heck, I play a tank mage, rather poorly), I was just wondering what everyone elses thoughts on this are and how it came to be like this.
You have the Tank mages using various weapons, even archery. They suffer from low dex, but make up for it by utilizing the 2 second re-equip swing and by holstering some of the most packed Total-Refresh stuffed backpacks I have ever seen.
Then there are the pure dexers, it seems that the most productive have some form of magery and make use of poisoned weapons. Some have Parry, some even have the poisoning skill to re-apply poison while moving. The current downfall as I understand it is the sometimes inability to kill someone before they recall, as the swing timer does not advance while moving.
Finally there is another catagory, that we used to call hybrids back on osi. I hear it called medi-dexer here however. These are like normal, bandaid-using, dexers, but they are also users of Magery coupled with Meditation, and I have seen some with eval, but that doesnt seem common. They tend to have only enough mana to cast a couple of Greater Heals at once.
It looks like a classic game of rock-paper-scissor from my standpoint. Equally played, Tank mages should have the upper hand on Dexers, as the dexer cannot heal quickly, and the capability of the tank to put out high damage in a small amount of time is damaging. Toss in the poison spell, and they become extremelt potion-reliant, at least until they run out of potions and possibly die from missing too many times in a row.
The Dexer has a clear advantage over the Medi-dexer. Armor reduces or eliminated the medi's mana regeneration rate, so naturally they sport little or none. The dexer can interupt the medi-dexer while he/she casts, due to the lack of wrestling. Without the ability to cast, the medidexer is quite defenseless to a fast weapon, that is likely poisoned, and they also lost a great deal amount of damage vs an opponent with parry.
The medi-dexer however, can be the crux of the Tank mages. They have endurance, they can keep swinging on a tank mage and interupt their 2-second weapon hits, while being able to heal, supplimented by bandaids, an ability not typical on the straight-dexer. Naturally, as they rely on casting heal/cure/debuff spells, they are likely to keep one precasted, in the same way a tank would have explode or something cast.
Here is what I am curious about. If a dexer attacks a Tank Mage and sticks to them using attack-last, they get ousted as using poor tactics, even if they are victorious. A medi-dexer, whos template is created around pre-casting heal, will be criticized substantially for pre-casting the very heal that may deem him victorious. The tank mage, can be ousted for using either one of those tactics as well.
The three major templates there all have a weapon skill. Fencing is common with poisoners but seems to suffer from a low magic-weapon drop. Swords is popular because of the speed of the katana, as well as the high damage of the hally, plus they are poisonable. Macing, deals out some low damage numbers, but the speed and damage over time of the quarterstaff are great, and the stamina-draining effect can be devestating. Archery, is very slow, due to it's lack of insta-refresh, but can be greay on a dexer for a killing blow, or for a tank mage that roams in a group.
The rules of PvP.
Ok, so you cannot pre-cast heal. Ok, well why not?? It's okay to precast and hold explode, but not heal? I understand this makes fights long and drawn out, but this is clearly biased agains medi-dexers and other defensive playstyles.
No poison or potions allowed...
Ok, well the dexer is screwed for the most part then, unless they sport some magery, there is a good chance the floor will be wiped with them.
..except for Red Pots.
WHAT? Ok, so your saying, a heal potion, that a dexer relies on, cannot be used, but a red potion, that a tank mage would NEED to survive agains a macer of any sort are completely okay? Even though the tank chose to have such a low amount of dex, directly effecting his stamina to begin with? How does that work?
Clearly all of these strategies, have some distinct advantages. A tank mage had better kill a macer before their stamina runs out, a dexer had better do a great job of staying on top of a tank mage/mage or else they risk being destroyed by a Hally-swingin-fastcast-parade, and a medidexer would be lucky to even kill someone with such a low damage output, and while poisoning and macing helps, they cannot re-apply poison and will run out of weapons, and opponents can defend agains the mace-stamina loss.
It all seems logically even from this standpoint, but the rules of "PvP" are completely in favor of the Tank Mage. Why is this?
I'm not trying to make a bash against tank-mages, or any other styles of play. (Heck, I play a tank mage, rather poorly), I was just wondering what everyone elses thoughts on this are and how it came to be like this.