Thoughts on the latest Patch

[Jaster]

A lot of people seem to think debuffs are gonna be the end of all pvp. Keep in mind, there is a delay on casting them, just like every other spell.

2v1, you are gonna most likely die regardless of debuffs etc if you stay and fight vs 2 good mages.

2v2, if 1 is debuffing 1, the other can cross heal. If they are both debuffing, 0 damage is going out and you can mini heal.

You will see mini heal used, but you will see greater heal used just as much. Maybe not today, but the more people play with the system and realize that there are better ways to kill than spamming debuffs and hally swings [especially in the field], you'll be less and less. The debuff hally spams are mainly in 1v1 duels on foot. In the field if someone spammed debuffs and hally swings, id just keep moving away from them and heal bc they wouldn't be doing enough damage to me.

[Colisseus]

there was ZERO reason (and evidence) to implement these new delays...lets get rid of them asap

[Jaster]

there was ZERO reason (and evidence) to implement these new delays...lets get rid of them asap

That's not exactly true ...

[time2a]

one more if u dont mind loops, this stamina swing based change u think really going to affect as much i mean are the 100 100 25 templates still going to be as strong or is the medi macer going to have the win over on the hally mage. cus i mean at 25 stam u loose any of it, its going to cripple u id imagine if the swing is based on the remaining amount of stamina. i duno some light on this would be awesome thnx

[Jaster]

The stam based will be fine. Basically right now as I understand it, if you have full stamina, you swing a hally at 4.8s at 25 stamina. If you do not have full stamina, you swing it at the lowest stamina [1 or 0] which puts it upwards of like 6 seconds. The correction is going to take the percentage of the stamina you have left and make the time vary between 4.8s and the max[6 seconds i believe].

Example:

25 stamina [full stamina] : 4.8s hally swing
0 stamina [empty stamina bar]: 6s hally swing

15/25 stamina: 5.2s hally swing [<- not correct, just giving example]

currently its only 4.8s[lowest time for 25stamina] or 6s[highest time(not really sure about the actual highest time value)]

[Colisseus]

I and many players that I play with will not play until something is done about this and we have something official. I have spoken with Kaivan in vent who told me (only about 2 days ago) they actually have zero clue about recast and disrupt delays, they were just playing around with them. Derrick has restated it here as well today, so why the hell are we playing with this bogus stuff?


IMO there was 0 need and 0 evidence supporting a change, this change was completely out of character for this shard.

[Jaster]

Colisseus, if you actually read Derrick's post in this thread, he says that we have evidence about many of the changes. We also know that there was delay, but the exact amount whether it be .75s or 1s was what we didn't know for sure. He also goes in and explains that this is the best the shard has looked from a pvp standpoint when looking at accuracy.

There are 2 kinds of information/evidence.

1 points towards something.
1 points away from something.

The evidence pointed away from the prior systems and more in favor our current system.

[Finesse]

never known anything so wrong

bogus changes?

what we had originaly was bogus not this

so your saying a delay in casting if your disturbed isnt true to era? i agree it needs lowering slightly btw

or hold on do you want to be able to fast cast every spell without delay? or do you want a realistic fastcast system. witch also needs speeding up slightly

[Colisseus]

Colisseus, if you actually read Derrick's post in this thread, he says that we have evidence about many of the changes. We also know that there was delay, but the exact amount whether it be .75s or 1s was what we didn't know for sure. He also goes in and explains that this is the best the shard has looked from a pvp standpoint when looking at accuracy.

There are 2 kinds of information/evidence.

1 points towards something.
1 points away from something.

The evidence pointed away from the prior systems and more in favor our current system.

I failed to find where Derrick said the current one is more likely to be more accurate. I did however find him saying "whether its 0.75 or 1.0, we aren't sure" ... so why the hell make the change?

I understand you may have found an new uber leet strategy Jaster, but please lay off the F5. My original post still stands.

EDIT: Finesse, I won't even touch your post. You are a proven speedhacker that in every other post, lists things based off memory...just today I proved one of your topics incorrect. These boards aren't for memories, which have proved wrong more often than not.

[Finesse]

i dont think you answered my question? care to answer it this is the topic im currently posting in ty

[Jaster]

I failed to find where Derrick said the current one is more likely to be more accurate. I did however find him saying "whether its 0.75 or 1.0, we aren't sure" ... so why the hell make the change?

I understand you may have found an new uber leet strategy Jaster, but please lay off the F5. My original post still stands.

Well we know for certain the parts that a lot of people are taking issue with are correct, for example the lift/use delays, and the stamina based swing timer. What we're less sure of is the attack throttle, but that's the part that's actually been asked for. Whether the recast delay is 1.0 second or 0.75 seconds was up in the air and that's why we tried both, I think most will agree that the difference was minimal.

I honestly don't want to make a lot of little changes, we need to pick something and stick to it until we actually have real new information that shows that something might be wrong. This is the rightest it's ever been, and there are really only a couple minor variables here that are uncertain.

It's right there ... and I do not have an uber leet strategy, I just adapt very easily to change. Instead of crying like many other players do about the changes, I play with them and get a good feel for them while others just moan and bitch. If it is something I don't agree with, I search for the proof, as you should if you believe what we have to be incorrect.

F5

[Colisseus]

I failed to find where Derrick said the current one is more likely to be more accurate. I did however find him saying "whether its 0.75 or 1.0, we aren't sure" ... so why the hell make the change?

I understand you may have found an new uber leet strategy Jaster, but please lay off the F5. My original post still stands.

Well we know for certain the parts that a lot of people are taking issue with are correct, for example the lift/use delays, and the stamina based swing timer. What we're less sure of is the attack throttle, but that's the part that's actually been asked for. Whether the recast delay is 1.0 second or 0.75 seconds was up in the air and that's why we tried both, I think most will agree that the difference was minimal.

I honestly don't want to make a lot of little changes, we need to pick something and stick to it until we actually have real new information that shows that something might be wrong. This is the rightest it's ever been, and there are really only a couple minor variables here that are uncertain.

It's right there ... and I do not have an uber leet strategy, I just adapt very easily to change. Instead of crying like many other players do about the changes, I play with them and get a good feel for them while others just moan and bitch. If it is something I don't agree with, I search for the proof, as you should if you believe what we have to be incorrect.

F5

That doesn't mean anything more, he is talking about the things he knows are correct.

Everyone, here is the new pvp 1v1 strategy until this gets reverted:

Hally, Debuff anything that is 4th circle or higher (never cast these)
If you get your opponent interrupted (he had the balls to do something other than hally and debuff), now is your change to use a 6th circle while he's handcuffed.
Only mini heal.
Hally.
Spam debuff.

Can anyone beat this strategy? I think not.

EDIT: Also Loops, it's my understanding that Derrick doesn't have a whole lot of knowledge or experience with mage pvp, thats why everything he does here is based off evidence. Check out patch 43 for a quick example.

[Jaster]

Tried both refers to testing both on the test center, which was actually done.

And that tactic has already been beaten plenty of times, perhaps not by you, but by a handful of players both on test, and on live since the patch.

Everything is based off of evidence because every server was different. What I remember on Atlantic was different than what Faust remembers on Baja, which was different than what Malice remembers on Catskills/Chessy[?].

If we base the server off of pure memory, we pretty much get

UOFA [Ultima Online Finesse's Age]

[Colisseus]

Tried both refers to testing both on the test center, which was actually done.

And that tactic has already been beaten plenty of times, perhaps not by you, but by a handful of players both on test, and on live since the patch.

It was actualyl completely offtopic for me to even mention it, you said that I should do something to prove it isn't correct...

How about something be done to prove this is correct in ANY SORT OF WAY before it gets implemented? Once again, this is just another attempt of staff trying to FEEL out delays, how many different versions of it were on test with 0 evidence? Please find something that says what we had before wasn't right, or even an "easier" task:

please find something that mentions disrupt delays in era.

Pvpers get pissed off at pvp changing every 2 weeks, why do things that aren't even for sure to make it even worse?

[Finesse]

whats on test currently is clearly the best we have had rly well ballanced system.

ballance makes pvp.