I know I shouldn't ask, but...

[chumbucket]

I can only speak to my own experiences.

1. It is challenging to do well. Indeed, it is basically the only challenging thing in this game that is even mildly interesting to me. Doing it well usually involves a good deal of planning, knowing the mechanics of the shard fairly well, knowing who is who, and then working with others to make it all come together. A couple years back cA was super organized with multiple guild-wide resources such as a rune library of player houses. If the LoS issue were one back then, I don't think anyone would have gotten to macro anywhere for more than a few hours during the day, early evening and not even all that much at night. Well, you might could have acquired a macro permit!

2. It gets you involved in lots of crazy stuff if you don't make a secret of doing it. It's fun to write about. It's fun to get people angry at you and thereby acquire a long term enemy. It leads to all sorts of adventures. Once a guy spend a week or two doing nothing but spamming about the bank about how much he hated me. I find that exciting. People message me in IRC asking me to get at this or that person, or loot this or that house.

3. Justice! Some people have it coming, and it is fun to give it to them.

4. Also, it allows for a hard to explain element of style in play. We used to ask for permits to sell horses. I am almost always very polite in game. Most cA characters are recognizable just by appearance. I don't know how to explain it, but the sort of freewheeling style of the full time thief and griefer just leads to a more exciting game.

[DorianBrytestar]

I don't think you guys understand what "griefing" is. Killing you (afk or not) is NOT griefing.

So, causing grief to others is not griefing?

You are trying to make a joke, but killing someone once should not cause you grief.
One of the biggest draws to this game is the danger.

There is just about no place that you can be absolutely sure that you are safe from any harm.
Griefing in the online game sense would be to kill someone over and over again and stop them from being able to do anything.
Typically speaking, in most games with open pvp, the official rules (if there are any) are actually very relaxed regarding this as you should be able to go get your friends to help rout that evil villain that is attacking you!

[Gafron]

You are trying to make a joke, but killing someone once should not cause you grief.
One of the biggest draws to this game is the danger.

There is just about no place that you can be absolutely sure that you are safe from any harm.
Griefing in the online game sense would be to kill someone over and over again and stop them from being able to do anything.
Typically speaking, in most games with open pvp, the official rules (if there are any) are actually very relaxed regarding this as you should be able to go get your friends to help rout that evil villain that is attacking you!

I'm not interested in the actual mechanics of griefing. It is why the griefer griefs that interests me. Since there is very little to no wealth or item gain to be had why does the griefer do it? I knew pretty much the kind of responses I would get when I started the thread because I have asked this question before in other forums but occasionally I have gotten a response which has added to my knowledge. From past experience, most griefers do not see themselves as such. They have one or more rationalizations of their behavior, that never hold up under much scrutiny by the way, which allows them to believe they are not primarily just causing pain to other people. In the end the answers I have got to this question all seem to boil down to an enjoyment of causing other people pain. I just keep asking to see if there is anything else out there to explain this behavior.

[chumbucket]

Also, being the bad guy is genuinely. People treat you differently. And, not to say I am all altruism, but it is good to know that the shard has genuine danger in it and that I help provide it.

[nubnub]

I am recently back playing UO (17 days in - UO2A is awesome) after an 11 year hiatus from OSI/EA UO and I've only encountered a couple of 'griefers' after being back. Although their actions are puzzling, I think they add a realistic dynamic to the game and thus add to the immersive aspect that makes UO attractive and exciting. Shortly after being back I was macroing magery at the bank and in between conference calls I glanced over and saw Princess Joshua(sp) tossing explosion potions at me so I quickly ran out of the way and avoided the death. I had zero items on me (using restock agent) and I advised Princess Joshua that he was wasting his time, I had no regs/items on me. He informed me that he doesn't kill macroers for the loot, he likes the dead bodies and he has "20 reds" so he is not worried about the counts either.

Although I don't understand what he gets out of killing macroers or the bodies, it is not for me to understand and that is what makes UO a fun place to cut loose. UO is a world of unpredictable individuals, all motivated by their individual needs/desires, wondering around an environment where they can pretty much do anything they want whether it makes sense to those on the receiving end or not. The griefer brings the real world a-hole to the virtual space and, in my opinion, makes the game exciting. They are the real world a-holes that drive like crap just because they can, the jerks that cut in line because they know most folks won't confront them, the clowns that go out of their way to avoid opening/holding a door for someone, etc... Or perhaps they are great individuals in the real world and the only place their conscious will allow them be a jerk is UO. Regardless, I don't mind them, although annoying and sometimes puzzling I appreciate the dynamic they add to the game. Heck, these clowns even found a way to make macroing exciting/challenging and for that I give them some credit.

Glad to be back and excellent shard (yeah yeah, I will get around to donating ).

[DorianBrytestar]

Griefers = T Rex Enjoy

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=znxFrgql5dc

[OhSnap]

To answer your question, some men just want to watch the world burn.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=efHCdKb5UWc

[Light Shade]

Like I touched on before...its a game and if everyone played good characters then this game would be akin to Farmville.

Takes all kinds.

I will say this, though... The 'bad guys' of decent skill far outnumber 'good guys' of decent skill on this server.

We need a revival of guilds like the Dungeon Guards.

[Loathed]

Like I touched on before...its a game and if everyone played good characters then this game would be akin to Farmville.

Takes all kinds.

I will say this, though... The 'bad guys' of decent skill far outnumber 'good guys' of decent skill on this server.

We need a revival of guilds like the Dungeon Guards.

+1 sir, +1

[archaicsubrosa77]

The other day I was picking fights with just an arm/disarm left hand, bandage self no timer hotkeys embedded....that was fun. Sometimes I didn't even bandage when I was low to see how long it would take for these three guys to kill me When I died I did it again. I would double clicky some major spell, attacked them with this normal fireball staff I got off a lich and just in the words of Forest Gump. "Just kept run-ning"

It was amazing the only times I died was when I tried to double click another spell or just stood there. It was actually fun though not worrying about having trapped pouches and potions and not at all trying to win. I just fought them knowing I would lose...and for some reason that was extremely fun

So its complete opposite for me.

This is the best way to get rid of the win at all costs afraid to die and take risks mentality

end this newb on newb violence and pick a losing fight and I bet you'll have more fun

[Blaise]

It was actually fun though not worrying about having trapped pouches and potions and not at all trying to win. I just fought them knowing I would lose...and for some reason that was extremely fun

Someone's figured out my method apparently....

[Loathed]

impossible to defend against those who have nothing to lose