Please don't remove guild chat, here's why.

[Psilo]

Blackfoot, this is on topic with what the author is basing his arguement off of. Carefully read the quote from above and you will see that the author of this thread wants to make guild chat an exception to era accuracy just like the automated tournaments. He wants tournaments to go if guild chat does and I feel the same. This is the reason the author started with the subject "Please don't remove guild chat, here's why.".

So this entire 13 page thread was based off a bad argument to begin with.
Pointing to one thing and saying 'because this is era innacurate, it shoudl be ok for these things to be era inaccurate too.'

very obviously, a bad arguement.

'Because we have guild chat which is era in accurate, we should have left in the new crafting menus'
'Because we have guild chat which is era inaccurate, we should have left in customizable vendors.'
''Because we have guild chat which is era in accurate, we should have left in newbie bank checks'

How can people seriously continue to make this argument page after page?

There's more to this thread than just that...or else it wouldn't be 13 pages long. There's good arguements on both sides if you ask me.

[Corbin]

There's more to this thread than just that...or else it wouldn't be 13 pages long. There's good arguements on both sides if you ask me.

Except that the argument is based on a feature that people want to keep which isn't era accurate but simply makes life easier. This is why I made the comment about adding the new crafting gumps if guild chat stays in because it would make life for crafters much easier while not being exactly era accurate. I'm just being fair here. If we're going to add things to the game that were actually good changes, why stop at the one thing?

Honestly, it's the one complaint I have about era accurate shards. While EA didn't have a whole lot of good changes, there were a couple. Guild chat, new gumps, moongates that bring up menus rather than cycling (though I would hate to see that changed because of nostalgia and RP purposes). It's just a shame that some of these things aren't used because they aren't considered "era accurate" because they were some of the very few good things EA did.

[BenBrawl]

I vote to keep guildchat. Not only do i not want to be force into using another program, but i doubt noobs will find it user friendly.

I see no reason to remove it other then its NEA

[BlackFoot]

I vote to keep guildchat. Not only do i not want to be force into using another program,

no ones forcing you to do anything

[Pristiq]

I vote to keep guildchat. Not only do i not want to be force into using another program,

no ones forcing you to do anything

I am.

*Cracks knuckles.*

[marmalade]

Blackfoot, this is on topic with what the author is basing his arguement off of. Carefully read the quote from above and you will see that the author of this thread wants to make guild chat an exception to era accuracy just like the automated tournaments. He wants tournaments to go if guild chat does and I feel the same. This is the reason the author started with the subject "Please don't remove guild chat, here's why.".

So this entire 13 page thread was based off a bad argument to begin with.
Pointing to one thing and saying 'because this is era innacurate, it shoudl be ok for these things to be era inaccurate too.'

very obviously, a bad arguement.

'Because we have guild chat which is era in accurate, we should have left in the new crafting menus'
'Because we have guild chat which is era inaccurate, we should have left in customizable vendors.'
''Because we have guild chat which is era in accurate, we should have left in newbie bank checks'

How can people seriously continue to make this argument page after page?

you're misunderstanding the argument. the point of bringing up events (among other things) is that, despite the fact that this shard's aim is to replicate the mechanics as accurately as possible, exceptions have been made. you cannot deny that the automated event system is a massive exception. if such a massive exception can be made then why not make a tiny exception for something like guild chat which doesn't do much except to facilitate communication?

if you make an exception for automated events (which have NEVER existed in any era on osi) then where do you draw the line when people ask for an exception to be made with something as small and useful as guildchat? if events are kept in because lots of people enjoy playing them (what other reason are they left in?) then why shouldn't guild chat be kept in if lots of people want it kept it?

again, automated events have a huge effect on the social dynamics of the shard, yet an exception is made for them. why? if an exception is made with something so huge, what reason is there not to make an exception with EVERYTHING else that isnt era accurate? especially tiny things like guildchat which do nothing except help people communicate without using 3rd party programs.

if no exception is to be made with guildchat, then there is no reason for an exception to be made with ANYTHING else.

[BlackFoot]

you're misunderstanding the argument. the point of bringing up events (among other things) is that, despite the fact that this shard's aim is to replicate the mechanics as accurately as possible, exceptions have been made.

The only exception being made being a mechanically integrated event system was part of the 'mission statement' on the release of the shard. So in the very end when the server has reached its goal and its completely 100% mechanically accurate it will remain the only exception. If I understand the original line correctly... but at this point admins will not be spending their time researching and coding but on ingame content.. hopefully and the autoevents wont be 'needed'.

Allowing little inaccurate changes will just result in even more of the 'this is inaccurate so its ok to make this inaccurate' posts. It will end up in even more frustrated people not understanding why their requests for inaccurate additions are not being taken seriously when other peoples are. Sticking to the guns will end up being more beneficial to players and the server in the long run than guildchat would be.

[Derrick]

I also would frown more on intentionally adding inaccurate stuff than I would on putting off it's removal. On the argument that we have one things that is inaccurate and not the other, the only real question is when do we address them not if. There are inaccuracies that pop up all the time, and they are handled or put off according to the complexity of the fix, and honestly, to some extent the shock value to the shard. We try to make gradual changes towards accuracy so that players don't just log in one day and feel like they have logged in somewhere else. It's easy to adapt to a lot of these changes as long as you don't feel like someone bashed you with a sledgehammer.

There are a lot of issues that have been on the back burner for some time, I'm likely going to get the party system out soon, but there are plenty of other issues to work on right now in addition to guild chat, or events for that matter; although events have been cut back quite a bit over the last few weeks.

[Corbin]

If events are removed, how will items like black dye tubs be obtained?

[Brules]

If events are removed, how will items like black dye tubs be obtained?

Much less frequently!

[Pirul]

If events are removed, how will items like black dye tubs be obtained?

You will actually have to go out and play the game to earn some gold to pay for it. *shocked*

[Corbin]

You will actually have to go out and play the game to earn some gold to pay for it. *shocked*

If they are used as a gold sink, that would be one thing, but then a special vendor would have to be setup to sell them and a price decided upon. I'm fine with these items being sold for gold over silver anyway as long as we can still access them.

Heck, as Derrick was saying before, I'd be all for expanding the items that were around in T2A but pretty much unobtainable.

[nightshark]

You will actually have to go out and play the game to earn some gold to pay for it. *shocked*

If they are used as a gold sink, that would be one thing, but then a special vendor would have to be setup to sell them and a price decided upon. I'm fine with these items being sold for gold over silver anyway as long as we can still access them.

Heck, as Derrick was saying before, I'd be all for expanding the items that were around in T2A but pretty much unobtainable.

If events are removed, you could just look at the current silver:gold ratio and have vendors sell them at this price. New black dye tubs are always currently coming into the economy anyway, so at least this way it would be a gold sink and not just gold transferring hands. The problem with doing that is that you forever limit their sell value to what the NPC vendor is selling for (though, over time with more being introduced through the silver system, their value is expected to drop anyway).

IMO these items should not be obtainable, I have posted my feeling towards them: you could not introduce new black dye tubs into the game in '99, you had to buy them from people who obtained them from xmas '98. There are probably enough black dye tubs in the game now to warrant their removal from the silver system. Same goes for stuff like neon hair dye.

[MatronDeWinter]

The problem with the above analogy, is that as the era becomes more accurate, and we have all the items introduced (even ones that were pre-t2a, server births etc), what is left?

Are we in a state of cyclic t2a, reliving the era every few years, or are we moving towards one point where we will remain stationary.

[BlackFoot]

Buying items for gold from an npc, that would otherwise be unobtainable presents a whole other serious of issues. It would need to be well thought out.