Poison

[Ronk]

Deadly is the only poison I recall draining stamina...and it drained it fast enough that you'd be stupid to go 'running away'.

Also, another question, I suppose, is does the first tick of damage start the moment you are poisoned? I don't ever recall waiting 5 seconds before a deadly poisoned foe dropped to near half health. It seemed...faster.

[Faust]

This one is interesting related with Ophedian Avenger:

http://groups.google.com/group/rec.game ... %2B1999%22
The first poster says : level 5
The second poster corrects : level 4

Now, who's right? Beats me...

Stratics '99 web site under the hunters guide states that they use Lethal Poison.

That part of the web site has been pretty reliable for the loot and other various data.

My personal recollection is that they dealt lethal poison based on my memory. I know that Avenger's dealt a poison that wasn't always curable and DP was always a breeze to cure with gc's and the cure spell at GM magery. I know Lethal was a pain to cure mostly always resulting in death on my tinker that had apprentice magery when testing the poison traps laced with a lethal dose.

Also, another question, I suppose, is does the first tick of damage start the moment you are poisoned? I don't ever recall waiting 5 seconds before a deadly poisoned foe dropped to near half health. It seemed...faster.

Yes, it always done the tick at the end of the timer including the first tick. UOR later changed this by separating the first tick from the consecutive ticks. The first tick would always be dished out with in 3 seconds for all poisons followed by the consecutive ticks afterwards in the standard increments for the damage timer.

I confirmed this function awhile back in the demo that showed that the poison would be applied waiting the standard tick values listed in the url link above by Kaivan until the damage was dealt. For example, a lesser poison would wait 15 seconds after being applied to dish out the first damage tick followed by another every 15 seconds after the damage. This worked differently sometime after the UOR publish where after the poison was applied waiting 3 seconds to dish out the first damage tick followed by the standard ticks afterwards.

[Hicha]

Sorry Kaarug, thought you were talking about curing poisons again.

I did some testing tonight, these are my results (poisoning a char with 100 str.)

Archive: Poison (Lesser) loss of approx. 1%-2% of Health every 5 secs.
UOSA: Poison (Lesser) loss of approx. 5% of Health every 10 secs.

Archive: Poison loss of approx. 5%-10% of Health every 4 secs.
UOSA: Poison loss of approx. 3-4% of Health every 15 secs.

Archive: Poison (Greater) loss of approx. 10%-15% of Health every 3 secs.
UOSA: Poison (Greater) loss of approx. 7% of Health every 10 secs.

Archive: Poison (Deadly) loss of approx. 10%-40% of Health every 3 secs.
UOSA: Poison (Deadly) loss of approx. 9% of Health every 5 secs.

I couldn't believe how weak DP actually is. There are several references to poison damage, whether it's 10%-40% for 3 or 5 secs, either way the current damage is completely off.

If these tests are correct, that seems a little weak. Does the the poison tick every 5 secs? So thats what? At 100 hp,-9,-8.2,7.4 or 91,82.8,75.4 after 15 secs? The wiki, is a post from Stratics I assume, saying its 13% every 5 secs. Also hiicha how much stamina did it drain and when? If the wiki isn't accurate about the HP drain then what about stamina drain?

The poison didn't start ticking until after the displayed times. So you'd get DPed, 5 secs later it would tick and ur HP estimates are correct. I didn't check stamina as I was only interested in $= drain. I will test this when I get home

[Hicha]

Ok did some more testing, once you get below 45% hp, it starts taking 10 stamina every 5 seconds. Deadly Poison lasts 55 seconds.

You would die within 6 seconds of being dp'd at full 100 str. Why would it be weaker?

You must've overlooked the actual damage done by DP. If you're at 100 HP and are DPed, the poison will wear off after 55 seconds, leaving you with ~20% HP left. Don't forget you also regen HP, so it actually lowers the total damage done from DP.

You cannot die from just being DPed at 100 STR. The damage done by UOSA DP comes nowhere close to the 10%-40% damage claimed by the several references which have been provided earlier.

[Kraarug]

...

Also, another question, I suppose, is does the first tick of damage start the moment you are poisoned? I don't ever recall waiting 5 seconds before a deadly poisoned foe dropped to near half health. It seemed...faster.

Yes, it always done the tick at the end of the timer including the first tick. UOR later changed this by separating the first tick from the consecutive ticks. The first tick would always be dished out with in 3 seconds for all poisons followed by the consecutive ticks afterwards in the standard increments for the damage timer.

I confirmed this function awhile back in the demo that showed that the poison would be applied waiting the standard tick values listed in the url link above by Kaivan until the damage was dealt. For example, a lesser poison would wait 15 seconds after being applied to dish out the first damage tick followed by another every 15 seconds after the damage. This worked differently sometime after the UOR publish where after the poison was applied waiting 3 seconds to dish out the first damage tick followed by the standard ticks afterwards.

Two things, In this T2A era post it states 3 second ticks for both Greater and Deadly Poison:
http://web.archive.org/web/199910182028 ... ctic1.html

The URL Post that Kaivan provided shows 5 seconds.

Batin's post also shows 3 second ticks.
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.game ... ing+poison

I don't think OSI changed it from 3 seconds, to 5 seconds and back to 3 seconds for first tick. I think 3 second ticks were the standard in T2A as voiced by both links above, both dated in the T2A Era.

The poison damage essay states that the 'remaining hps' were calcuated for damage every other tick.

I would think that greater and deadly poison should be set at 3 second ticks with the damage range assigned randomly at each calculation performed at every other tick. When the victim gets below 25% health, their stamina gets depleted for DP only.

[Ronk]

Just another random thing to throw out there...a piece of logic really, though im sure it could be deemed flawed.

At one point, OSI deemed that poisoning was too powerful and they altered the game so you had to have poisoning on the character you wanted to poison with. They also altered it so poison would degrade weapons.

I think its worth keeping this in mind when we discuss poisoning as well. They would not have nerfed a skill that did pitiful damage and was easy to cure. Though please note, I am not suggesting that the above logic is proof of anything.

[Arkosh Kovasz]

...

Also, another question, I suppose, is does the first tick of damage start the moment you are poisoned? I don't ever recall waiting 5 seconds before a deadly poisoned foe dropped to near half health. It seemed...faster.

Yes, it always done the tick at the end of the timer including the first tick. UOR later changed this by separating the first tick from the consecutive ticks. The first tick would always be dished out with in 3 seconds for all poisons followed by the consecutive ticks afterwards in the standard increments for the damage timer.

I confirmed this function awhile back in the demo that showed that the poison would be applied waiting the standard tick values listed in the url link above by Kaivan until the damage was dealt. For example, a lesser poison would wait 15 seconds after being applied to dish out the first damage tick followed by another every 15 seconds after the damage. This worked differently sometime after the UOR publish where after the poison was applied waiting 3 seconds to dish out the first damage tick followed by the standard ticks afterwards.

Two things, In this T2A era post it states 3 second ticks for both Greater and Deadly Poison:
http://web.archive.org/web/199910182028 ... ctic1.html

The URL Post that Kaivan provided shows 5 seconds.

Batin's post also shows 3 second ticks.
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.game ... ing+poison

I don't think OSI changed it from 3 seconds, to 5 seconds and back to 3 seconds for first tick. I think 3 second ticks were the standard in T2A as voiced by both links above, both dated in the T2A Era.

The poison damage essay states that the 'remaining hps' were calcuated for damage every other tick.

I would think that greater and deadly poison should be set at 3 second ticks with the damage range assigned randomly at each calculation performed at every other tick. When the victim gets below 25% health, their stamina gets depleted for DP only.

From Baitlins post you linked above:

[A mage would waste ALL of his mana curing poison, which is applied fresh about every 3
seconds./quote]

I believe he was referring to that once cured, the poison is quickly reaplied by the Ophidian about 3 seconds after. I'm at work so couldn't visit the other link you posted. My memory of T2A deadly poison is very hazy, because I hardly saw anyone using it on Great Lakes in 98-99. I knew one Master Assassin, and thought he was the COOLEST EVER! with that title.

[Faust]

Arkosh is correct...

It's quite obvious the "poster" is referring to the poison applying since he clearly states that in the thread...

Sorry Kraarug, but having precise accurate OSI code from the demo and an article written in March '00 that is a HUNDRED PERCENT pin point accurate to that code last compiled in Summer '98 is all she wrote in regard to this topic.

You are clearly holding onto this topic as well just like the curing formula that was obviously accurate.

]Just another random thing to throw out there...a piece of logic really, though im sure it could be deemed flawed.

At one point, OSI deemed that poisoning was too powerful and they altered the game so you had to have poisoning on the character you wanted to poison with. They also altered it so poison would degrade weapons.

I think its worth keeping this in mind when we discuss poisoning as well. They would not have nerfed a skill that did pitiful damage and was easy to cure. Though please note, I am not suggesting that the above logic is proof of anything.

I pointed out the change in regard to the poisoning skill making a mage poison better in a previous thread. This feature was way out of our date range even past the UOR era. Also, the fact that the formula change for the cure spell actually took place after the poisoning skill implementation means curing even after that feature was still easy.

[Finesse]

i dont know if anyones pointed this out i coulent be bothered to read all this but

poison eles poison wasnt the same as tinker traps

poison eles poison was more like dp and took 1/4 cure spells from a gm mage or 1/2 greater cure potions

tinker traps lethal poison was uncurable by spells and took 10+ greater cure potions to cure if you were lucky i remeber spamming g heal while trying to cure if you took this poison.

dp from wep took about 4 cure casts to cure everytime you rarely cured it first time and greater cures failed to cure it quite alot [its debateable this was because of none gm alchemist though]

all higher level poisons on this shard seem to tick far to slowly while taking damage from a dexer on osi you were barely able to get a cure spell between dp tick and hits.

[Kraarug]

Arkosh is correct...

It's quite obvious the "poster" is referring to the poison applying since he clearly states that in the thread...

Sorry Kraarug, but having precise accurate OSI code from the demo and an article written in March '00 that is a HUNDRED PERCENT pin point accurate to that code last compiled in Summer '98 is all she wrote in regard to this topic.

You are clearly holding onto this topic as well just like the curing formula that was obviously accurate.

Faust, are you saying that what we have here is correct? I'd laugh if I thought that you were not dead serious.

First all I know there's a discrepancy between damage timing with the sources researched and presented. One source, which you haven't attempted to discredit yet, sets damage ticks at 3 seconds and a DP damage Range of 10 to 40%.

http://web.archive.org/web/200002072321 ... ctic1.html

Another source, the source of curing you've attempted to discredit, sets damage ticks at 5 seconds also with a DP damage range of 10 to 40%. (You've completely discounted this source saying that a near GM Mage sometimes takes multiple attempts to cure DP poison)

http://web.archive.org/web/199911040027 ... sessay.htm

My point is, if you discredit one then the other must be accepted.

Now, oh sage of UO, what exactly does the Demo Code set the damage ticks to and, much more importantly, what sorts of damage does it deal out?

I think you'll find that what we have here is something more along the lines of UO:R poison (Only 13 HPs) without the mimimum damage. THis, my failed debunker, is not T2A.

http://wiki.uosecondage.com/index.php?title=Poisoning

So, why don't you state your case Faust and, more importantly and especially when dealing with you, list your sources.

Unlike you, I am wanting an accurate replication of T2A regardless of assistance of play style. You have proven to be biased beyond reason. That's why I am working on this topic, like I did with interruption, until it's correct.

[Faust]

I have no idea what we are "currently" using here on UOSA at the moment. However, the article that you produced saying the "tick" value is 3 seconds is flat out wrong and not accurate at all in regard to the timer value. The article that Kaivan has pointed out is correct since it's a pin point accurate representation of the demo code and timers providing two TOP NOTCH sources unlike your research has showed us. I cannot access any of the information links at the moment since I am at work, but if the percentile damage value is accurate to the demo in Kaivan's article(that I will post below) than that is correct too. I will be honest and tell you that I don't know if that is the case on here since I frankly don't know what the values are right now and have limited access to majority of the content.

Unlike you, I am wanting an accurate replication of T2A regardless of assistance of play style. You have proven to be biased beyond reason. That's why I am working on this topic, like I did with interruption, until it's correct.

Please spare me with these ignorant comments.

We all know that you are well beyond bias and that has been proven countless times based on your horrible research... I have rarely if ever been wrong in my research unlike you. I could name several of your failed attempts off the top of my head that shows how consistently off base your research has been in the past.


PS
This poison damage discussion was over 2 pages ago and leaves me to wonder why you are asking what the demo values even are or disputing my comments that reiterate Kaivan's research... This clearly shows how much you even pay attention to the topic at hand and the bias approach that you always take towards trying to prove your desperate attempts at how right you are...

Just to add some information regarding poison damage, here is a link to the 04/14/2000 archive of the poisoning essay which provides information on the amount of damage that poison spells did.

The information for poison damage in that essay matches the values seen in the demo and ultimately provides us with two separate sources that appear on either side of the T2A era that show the same values. This pretty much throws the chips in with the idea that poison damage in the demo and during T2A were indeed the same.

[Hicha]

Sorry Kraarug, but having precise accurate OSI code from the demo and an article written in March '00 that is a HUNDRED PERCENT pin point accurate to that code last compiled in Summer '98 is all she wrote in regard to this topic.

You are clearly holding onto this topic as well just like the curing formula that was obviously accurate.

Nobody is arguing the curing formula; this discussion is about accurate poison damage. You keep bringing it up trying to derail this thread.

There are several references for poison damage formulas, the only discrepancy is whether the damage ticked for 3 secs instead of 5 (they all point to the same damage calculations,) and that's only 1 site claiming 3 sec ticks, so we can assume it's the latter. Batlin even made a reference to the demo stating how much more damaging poisons are versus the current state in UOSA.

I cannot access any of the information links at the moment since I am at work, but if the percentile damage value is accurate to the demo in Kaivan's article(that I will post below) than that is correct too."

Way to discredit the links without even reading them. You can state you are trying to do whats "accurate" for the server, but statements like this and discrediting sites and references without so much as clicking the link only make me believe you're all for tailoring this server to your playstyle.

[Faust]

hiicha, please re-read my post again.

Sorry Kraarug, but having precise accurate OSI code from the demo and an article written in March '00 that is a HUNDRED PERCENT pin point accurate to that code last compiled in Summer '98 is all she wrote in regard to this topic.

You are clearly holding onto this topic as well just like the curing formula that was obviously accurate.

I said that he is holding onto this thread just like he did with the thread that involved the cure formula even those this thread was over 2 pages again when he was discredited by Kaivan.

Way to discredit the links without even reading them. You can state you are trying to do whats "accurate" for the server, but statements like this and discrediting sites and references without so much as clicking the link only make me believe you're all for tailoring this server to your playstyle.

Why must I discredit his links when they have already been discredited by other people here?

There is no need for me to discredit his sources that have already been discredit. I was merely reiterating Kaivan's post about TWO TOP NOTCH sources(demo + poison article) that clearly show the damage and timer for poison that is a HUNDRED PERCENT accurate with each other since he obviously didn't bother to ever read it previously. I have already reviewed Kraarug's links earlier on in this thread when it was first posted. However, I still don't REMEMBER the EXACT values listed on those sites which I was clearly pointing out when I mentioned that I cannot access it while at work...

Kraarug's source is based on one simple alchemy guide that isn't even in relation to poison damage or timers said the damage happened in 3 seconds that tha author could have easily screwed up on. His other source was already discredited by another individual in this thread that clearly stated that poison was re-applied about every "3 seconds" not have a damage tick in 3 seconds...

Again, what is the point of me discrediting his sources when they have already been discredited by other people in this thread?

I would suggest thinking about your written responses better next time around before submitting them...

[Kraarug]

hiicha, please re-read my post again.

Sorry Kraarug, but having precise accurate OSI code from the demo and an article written in March '00 that is a HUNDRED PERCENT pin point accurate to that code last compiled in Summer '98 is all she wrote in regard to this topic.

You are clearly holding onto this topic as well just like the curing formula that was obviously accurate.

I said that he is holding onto this thread just like he did with the thread that involved the cure formula even those this thread was over 2 pages again when he was discredited by Kaivan.

Way to discredit the links without even reading them. You can state you are trying to do whats "accurate" for the server, but statements like this and discrediting sites and references without so much as clicking the link only make me believe you're all for tailoring this server to your playstyle.

Why must I discredit his links when they have already been discredited by other people here?

There is no need for me to discredit his sources that have already been discredit. I was merely reiterating Kaivan's post about TWO TOP NOTCH sources(demo + poison article) that clearly show the damage and timer for poison that is a HUNDRED PERCENT accurate with each other since he obviously didn't bother to ever read it previously. I have already reviewed Kraarug's links earlier on in this thread when it was first posted. However, I still don't REMEMBER the EXACT values listed on those sites which I was clearly pointing out when I mentioned that I cannot access it while at work...

Kraarug's source is based on one simple alchemy guide that isn't even in relation to poison damage or timers said the damage happened in 3 seconds that tha author could have easily screwed up on. His other source was already discredited by another individual in this thread that clearly stated that poison was re-applied about every "3 seconds" not have a damage tick in 3 seconds...

Again, what is the point of me discrediting his sources when they have already been discredited by other people in this thread?

I would suggest thinking about your written responses better next time around before submitting them...

Faust, what is described in Batiln's link does not exist here on UOSA with your 'assumed accurate' poison system. Why do you think that is the case? Kaivian post is UO:R Information. It woudn’t be the first time that OSI reverted a system.

You tend to selectively discount things that don't go your way. You take what fits your wants from all three sources and discount the other information.

So, try to explain how the events occurred as described in Batlin's thread with the system we have here on UOSA.

Was the poster wrong there in 1999 too? Did poison work differently on Baja? That’s right, you kept rulling poison weapons out of your duels so how would you know.

The fact is, our UOSA poison system is not the way it worked in T2A and, just like you tried to defend your macro-ready flawed static 2500 ms insta-hit-refresh timer, you are just blindly defending what benefits you. Or, perhaps more accurately, you do know the truth but you're just trying to manipulate the situation. Either would be par for your course.

Should I post the msg you sent right after it was decided that wrestling was indeed the proper mechanic that produced insta-hits post 2.99? It was miraculous that less than a day after you lost that argument that you were able to post sources in that message that CONFIRMED exactly what I was saying. You spent pages and pages arguing against me, making personal attacks and making those “100% without a doubt” statements that you knew were wrong.

And, in this thread, you claimt that you were right with wrestling? Perhaps you dug up the proper mechanic the first time, you just wanted something that benefited your play style better though and aruged against your own research.
It wouldn’t take the wits of a 25 watt light bulb to see that you were withholding information because it benefitted your position.
So back on topic; explain why, if our poison system was accurate, that what is described in Batilin’s thread is not the case here on UOSA?

So yeah, I'm holding on to this subject until it's fixed. Just like I did with Inst-Hit and invulerable stable masters. Thanks in part to that effort, we now have an accurate system.

I may not know exactly what the poison system was like in late 1999, but I know it wasn’t UO:Rs (as posted by Kaivian) and a lousy 13 pts of damage per 5 seconds as referenced.

So far, 3 era sources show a flat 13 points was not the case. Where are your sources Faust?

[Hicha]

There is no need for me to discredit his sources that have already been discredit. I was merely reiterating Kaivan's post about TWO TOP NOTCH sources(demo + poison article) that clearly show the damage and timer for poison that is a HUNDRED PERCENT accurate with each other since he obviously didn't bother to ever read it previously. I have already reviewed Kraarug's links earlier on in this thread when it was first posted. However, I still don't REMEMBER the EXACT values listed on those sites which I was clearly pointing out when I mentioned that I cannot access it while at work...

What makes Kaivan's post about the poison article a TOP NOTCH source and discredit's the others? Isn't Batlin's post TOP NOTCH as well? What actually defines whether a source is TOP NOTCH or not? If Faust agrees, it's TOP NOTCH?

Kraarug's source is based on one simple alchemy guide that isn't even in relation to poison damage or timers said the damage happened in 3 seconds that tha author could have easily screwed up on. His other source was already discredited by another individual in this thread that clearly stated that poison was re-applied about every "3 seconds" not have a damage tick in 3 seconds...

And it's impossible that the author of Kaivan's post could've made a mistake writing that guide? I believe the other source refers to how often an ophidian can apply poison, not how often the poison damage ticks (applies poison every 3 secs, damage ticks for 5 would make sense to me.)

We still have several other references referring to 5 sec ticks with 10-40% damage, but according to your logic they're all typos as well, right?