"Should Spell-Damage-Delays be reverted ? (Pre-Patch)

[Faust]

There has been plenty of shards that has tried this and it never has worked.

A decade of this and it hasn't happened. It won't happen, sorry. We will not be making the same mistake everyone else has done up to this point.

The mistake you are making is having all your players say "This isn't fun, this does not feel right" and being completely ignorant to it.

That is a far greater mistake in my opinion.

Sorry, caving in to people like you that requests or demands inaccurate change is what killed every other t2a server in the past decade. You haven't witnessed this same process well over a dozen times like I have. So you could not possibly ever understand it. If you cave in once for any inaccuracy your shard is essentially done for. It doesn't ever stop at that one change no matter how much you think it will. If a shard of 3000 players can die because of this reason any shard can.

[Michael Malloy]

Not to dissent from anyone's views here, as everyone (relatively) has been mature and presented their points well... but a big factor in playerbase size, too. There's only so many people here, and only so many of those PvP regularly. On an OSI server that number was way beyond what we have here, but the world is still the same size. No matter of tweaking or coding can help that. Just sayin'.

Also, the memories everyone has are from 10 years ago. You don't always remember the little things. Again, just sayin'.

[Hemperor]

Not to dissent from anyone's views here, as everyone (relatively) has been mature and presented their points well... but a big factor in playerbase size, too. There's only so many people here, and only so many of those PvP regularly. On an OSI server that number was way beyond what we have here, but the world is still the same size. No matter of tweaking or coding can help that. Just sayin'.

Also, the memories everyone has are from 10 years ago. You don't always remember the little things. Again, just sayin'.

I don't think this is so much about the quantity of encounters, as it is the quality of them in comparison to real T2A

[Michael Malloy]

Not to dissent from anyone's views here, as everyone (relatively) has been mature and presented their points well... but a big factor in playerbase size, too. There's only so many people here, and only so many of those PvP regularly. On an OSI server that number was way beyond what we have here, but the world is still the same size. No matter of tweaking or coding can help that. Just sayin'.

Also, the memories everyone has are from 10 years ago. You don't always remember the little things. Again, just sayin'.

I don't think this is so much about the quantity of encounters, as it is the quality of them in comparison to real T2A

Oh, absolutely, but when you have that many more people running around, your chances of running into those who don't have 7x GMs increases, yeah? I understand some of the complaints are because of spell delays and whatnot, but to your point about resist earlier it certainly holds weight.

[Creager]

What exactly is being argued, here? Spell damages?

I think what Faust is trying to get at, that these damage are based on dice rolls. There are extremes. This has been a common issue on every Free-server i have played. To me they feel the best here. Does anyone remember how fubb’d metropolis was when it came to EX/EB damages, and how stupid divinity got after a while? Unless the staff hard-codes the damages, its probably not possible to just 'up the base damages.'

To me it feels pretty darn close; if you want to create a valid argument then you probably need to start posting numbers.

[Jaster]

As much as I would like to see less 7x GM players and less GM resist characters, that doesn't matter as much as even I may have said in the past. What matters is that the pvp population of this server is obviously talking for a reason. No one is asking to recreate Divinity or any other server. What is being asked is to modify a few of the current numbers in a few areas perhaps that will bring back the feel of pvp during the T2A era.

POSSIBLE SUGGESTIONS:

1. Lengthen the explode delay a fraction of a second to allow it to stack with eb better on a more consistant basis.

2. Make weapon damage a little more consistant, [example: hally range instead of being from 4 damage to 50 damage after skills/stats added into equation/ make it 15-40 for a GM hally]

3. removing the magic damage barrier from town protection will liven up chaos/order wars because mages [which are the dominate class of t2a, will have more options to check for pvp in towns] Currently a low amount of order/chaos and war guild pvp because of this.

4. Remove dueling events from the event system. Make players come out and field play and run player run tournaments which will promote shard activity. Events should consist of CTF or a random tournament only created by a GM[not automated]

DISCUSS MY SUGGESTIONS!

[Faust]

Creager,

The beginning of this thread was suppose to be about the spell damage delay. However, this obviously took off into several different directions. So I will discuss the topic of this thread. The problem here is that the damage delay on all spells is 1 second. This means that when you target a spell such as an energy bolt it doesn't deal damage until 1 second after the target is initialized. All RunUO default pre-packaged code comes with a default of 0.5 seconds for the damage delay on spells. This server did have this pre default for many months until it was finally fixed. The majority of the people that are pissed off about this delay are those that previously played here and those that previously played other of these t2a shards that used this delay. They prefer the 0.5 second delay because it is what they are used too. That is essentially the problem in hand here for most people.

[Creager]

What are the spell delays? .5 * per circle? (Which i believe was what OSI used dunring the era) I was under the impression the RunUO default .5 sec damage delay was propotioned to .25 * circle spell delay.

[Faust]

+0.25 per circle starting at 0.5 for the first. This was verified through the Ultima Online demo to be accurate too.

[Hemperor]

Creager,

The beginning of this thread was suppose to be about the spell damage delay. However, this obviously took off into several different directions. So I will discuss the topic of this thread. The problem here is that the damage delay on all spells is 1 second. This means that when you target a spell such as an energy bolt it doesn't deal damage until 1 second after the target is initialized. All RunUO default pre-packaged code comes with a default of 0.5 seconds for the damage delay on spells. This server did have this pre default for many months until it was finally fixed. The majority of the people that are pissed off about this delay are those that previously played here and those that previously played other of these t2a shards that used this delay. They prefer the 0.5 second delay because it is what they are used too. That is essentially the problem in hand here for most people.

Well I have actually only seen Guerilla make this point so far. Spell damage delays are an important T2A mechanic IMO, extreme damages at GM resist is just mega lame.

I just said this in IRC but I will repeat it here. One EB can do 8 damage, the next can do 40. Same caster, same victim.

Technically, one person could EB someone 5 times, the other sends one EB back and they are at the same health. Randomness is a necessity in UO, but this is FAR too extreme and it exists in all damages. IMO I wouldn't consider this a mechanic of T2A, those are more things like spell delays, swing refreshes etc.

[Creager]

Technically, one person could EB someone 5 times, the other sends one EB back and they are at the same health. Randomness is a necessity in UO, but this is FAR too extreme and it exists in all damages. IMO I wouldn't consider this a mechanic of T2A, those are more things like spell delays, swing refreshes etc.

I've argued the same side, of this same issue, on plently of other forums for other free-shards. I think the best thing for you to do to help state your case would be to start posting numbers.

[Derrick]

If anyone is interested in spell damages, this is a great link:
http://web.archive.org/web/200003060630 ... stcalc.htm

I really do appreciate the constructiveness of a lot of these posts.

What this whole issue comes down to for me is that when we get it right it'll be right, and the only way we can get it correct is though working together. The goal is accurate mechanics because that's the common ground that's brought most of us here. As Platy said above, if something feels wrong than it very well may be wrong.

Lets focus on correcting that instead of making other things wrong to compensate for it.

The goal and purpose of this shard is 100% accuracy, or as close as we can get of course. If we don't do it here, no one else ever will.

[Green Taylor]

Did OSI PvP had a lot of luck elements involved in it? if not, how was it removed?

Because no matter how different it is from our shard, it had to be somewhat close... tho its my gut feeling that's talking

[Uthor Nlath]

I agree with what Gurrilla has presented here in this thread. And...I support the staff whole heartedly for what they are doing to make this shard feel like old times. Now that being said, and trying not to change the subject much, the PVP enviroment for this age was mainly a mages enviroment. Being a Dexxer (which I love to be) has a severe handicap on this shard. (I know I am beating a dead horse *horse still twitching*)
But to bring a more exciting PVP enviroment to this shard, shouldn't we consider the changes mentioned above and increase or make Dexxers somewhat even par with the whole PVP class? That in effect would attract more players that love to PVP and intereact with other players in the server. Just My opinion. *wonders off*

[Teknix]

POSSIBLE SUGGESTIONS:

1. Lengthen the explode delay a fraction of a second to allow it to stack with eb better on a more consistant basis.

2. Make weapon damage a little more consistant, [example: hally range instead of being from 4 damage to 50 damage after skills/stats added into equation/ make it 15-40 for a GM hally]

3. removing the magic damage barrier from town protection will liven up chaos/order wars because mages [which are the dominate class of t2a, will have more options to check for pvp in towns] Currently a low amount of order/chaos and war guild pvp because of this.

4. Remove dueling events from the event system. Make players come out and field play and run player run tournaments which will promote shard activity. Events should consist of CTF or a random tournament only created by a GM[not automated]

DISCUSS MY SUGGESTIONS!

#1. In this situation, I say leave it (at this moment in time, i say no. but how much of a change would be considered?)

#2. I vote yes (but this would have to apply to all weapons, must reduce the outliers on that dmg range)

#3. Leave it. Era accurate, no?

#4. I vote yes on this. More group events are needed