Trophy Turn in System / Event Updates

[Pirul]

I think the reward system is flawed. Not because of if you can get silver or not, but because you can get items not normally spawned in game. Did it happen on OSI? Using Faust's logic, no, it cannot be replicated because policy varied from shard to shard.

Events on the other hand take people away from the actual "playing" field. Last night you had at least 40 participants in CTF. But you went out after that, and all hot spots were deserted.

People get their fix of PvP in tournaments held in a Tramellized environment, and then they go back to their castles to stare at all the neat pixels they have been awarded for being OmGl33tPvPKtHxbAi.

I have stated my position on events many times before, and have all but given up on continuing that discussion. It is a policy decission at the end of the day, so it's up to management to run this place as best they think, I am just bumming their court.

EDIT:

Would removing silver reduce the player base? Probably.

Would removing silver reduce the actual number of players who go out to play in the "field"? Doubtful.

Would we care if the members we lost were members who mostly play tournys and hardly ever field? I wouldn't.

[Freeza]

I don't need to prove that silver is justified, shard policy has done that for me.

The only thing I need to prove is that any player has the opportunity to win silver if they choose to, and I think I have sufficiently done that.

I don't follow you at all, why are you bringing up taming and other activities then?

From what I understood:

What your saying is for example taming has a reward which would be the tamed creature to use for PvE so that is taming rewards.

PvP tournaments winning nets you a piece of silver. PvP tournaments do not take place in felluca (That is another thread) so the usual loot you would get from PvPing does not exist but you still get the reward of recognition.

Why should PvP be rewarded with silver while other things are not? I believe that is the question which many are asking.

The use of silver as a reward for PvP is whats in question, not the existence of silver.

[BobDobbs]

I didn't bring them up. Mikel did. Please read more closely.

PvP is rewarded with silver because that's shard policy. The only way you are excluded from participating in it is if you choose to be excluded. In which case, any claims of unfairness are null and void.

[Mikel123]

The reward for taming is the ability to farm monsters in relative safety.

The reward for collecting rares is the enjoyment one gains from collecting them.

You have the opportunity to participate in the tournaments if you choose to. But don't claim the system is inherently "BS" just because you're bad at them. I'm bad at them, so I don't participate, but I certainly don't demand that the opportunity be removed because I'm bad at tournaments.

I don't think this is about accuracy at all. I think this is about a perceived unfairness when one doesn't exist.

I don't need to prove that silver is justified, shard policy has done that for me.

The only thing I need to prove is that any player has the opportunity to win silver if they choose to, and I think I have sufficiently done that.

I've come to expect a higher level of discourse from you on this forum, and I must say I'm disappointed here. As others mentioned, there are plenty of in-game rewards for being a good pvper. Trash talk, bard loot, the feeling of relative safety in most areas, etc.

And are you seriously pulling out the "u just suk at pvp thats y u hate tourneys, noob"? Really?

DrF, yes, shard population would drop without the silver at the events. Personally, that's the only reason I think we still have the events as a whole. There's like a half-dozen duel arenas around the shard (amusing because a 1999 production shard, with 10x our population, would have maybe 1 or 2). There's another relatively safe duel arena on everyone's castle or keep roof, if they choose. If people wanted to have pvp tournaments for the sake of the competition itself, they'd all be player-run whenever it's convenient. But why do that when you can have your hand held for it, and an extra free no-risk chance at an in-game reward?

[Pirul]

Would removing silver reduce the player base? Probably.

Would removing silver reduce the actual number of players who go out to play in the "field"? Doubtful.

Would we care if the members we lost were members who mostly play tournys and hardly ever field? I wouldn't.

I re-Edited for correction.

[BobDobbs]

@Mikel,

I don't post my opinions to meet your approval, or anyone else's.

If that's what you got out of my posts in this thread, that's your problem and I don't particularly care.

I do care about losing players, especially for no other reason than to make you feel some sense of equality.

[Mikel123]

I do care about losing players

Well then let's put back insta-hit, damage spells always disrupting, debuff spells disrupting 100% of the time, some of the UOR housing options, the ability to see what level a treasure map is, cutting bandages all at once, and resist parties. That will get you a net result of more players.

I don't want more players if their requirement of joining is something that goes against the core goal of the shard. If all the leetpvpers of +- left because we weren't enough like RunUO for them (and, I get the impression this is what happened), then I don't want them here. Can't please everyone, that's life, move on. Likewise, if we lost a bunch of players because we took away our systematic events held in Trammel for in-game rewards, I don't want those players either.

I don't see any difference between one ridiculous inaccuracy (Trammel events for in-game rewards) and another (cutting bandages, spells always disrupt, etc.). I recognize that enforcing accuracy upon the former would cost us a lot more players than enforcing accuracy upon the latter... but that doesn't seem a valid enough reason to break the rule in my opinion.

[BobDobbs]

If this is an example of the logic you have such a high standard for, I'll happily disappoint you in the future.

You seem stuck in an Us vs Them mentality. We all play on the same shard and OMGLEETPVPERS farming silver doesn't impact your ability to enjoy the game whatsoever.

[Mikel123]

In some senses, you're right, but only because I find it's much less stressful to live life with that attitude.

On the other hand, if I'm looking at strict fairness, you're incorrect. Silver has a value, and it competes with things I have earned that have value. Clyde outbid me on some items in the trade forum the other day. He is a leetpvper who wins silver at tournaments. Despite my best efforts at being as good at killing gazers and mining ingots as I can be - things that are era-accurate - he can get more value from inaccurate things like these tournaments than I can get from accurate methods of wealth acquisition (accurate methods like... playing the game itself). So that is a fairness issue in my eyes. It ceases to be 1999 UO and becomes the sort of mish-mash game like all of the other RunUO shards.

[BobDobbs]

I'm sorry you have such a low opinion of a shard you spend so much time playing.

[DrFaustus]

I'm sorry you have such a low opinion of a shard you spend so much time playing.

A lot of people that "play" here seem to share such an opinion. Kinda ironic honestly.

[Pirul]

Yes Bob, loosing players sucks. But loosing players that I never saw because they only did tournaments, doesn't really have an impact on me, or my enjoyment of the game. It's as if you tell me a pink salamander that lived in the marshes of Indonesia just died. Well boo-hoo, but I really don't give a rat's ass.

It does however impact the economy of the environment I play on when Silver / Uniques from Trammel enter the market place. Why? Simply because they did not have to compete for spawn with the tamer with 3 drags at EG's. Because he didn't have to defend his loot from a gank of 4 comedians who want to kill my bard at Thera Keep. He didn't have to wait for an ore vein to respawn.

Silver is effectively "new" gold introduced into the game, very much like a government printing more new bills than the ones they destroy. The effect of that is inflation. There is no need for a gold sink (which is a term that has also been widely discussed here) if we stop introducing "new" money into the economy.

[Mikel123]

I'm sorry you have such a low opinion of a shard you spend so much time playing.

I'm sorry you have such a low opinion of a forum you spend so much time posting on.
I'm sorry you have such a pessimistic interpretation of everyone's words.
I'm sorry you chose to take my original post and respond with a childish insult at my tournament skills.
I'm sorry this is what an honest discussion has devolved into.
I'm sorry you chose to ignore the entire content of my last post and instead throw out yet another childish statement.

Look, I agree with Pirul. Events in Trammel are not T2A UO. So I have about as much interest in them as I would if we opened up a casino in Vesper where you could play Texas Hold'em silver coins. Or if you could recall to the Star Room and play a game of pong there, and the winner got a +20 kryss of power and a golden lute of barding.

IF the events didn't take players from the actual game world, and IF the prizes didn't leak into the actual game world, I don't think anyone would complain. If the winner of Capture the Flag got a purple neon sword that said "CTF WINNER WOOT!" that they could carry whenever they were in Tournament Trammel, I'd be fine with it. But when the come out of there and sell/trade their silver for items that were actually obtained according to the actual 1999 rules of UO, we have a problem.

[BlackFoot]

Slightly off topic but takin a piece of what you just said there

A fine Gold sink - neon purple swords that can only be carried/moved/touched etc in tourny areas
and other hilarious objects/wearables that can only be seen in trammel land

[BobDobbs]

I'm sorry you have such a low opinion of a shard you spend so much time playing.

I'm sorry you have such a low opinion of a forum you spend so much time posting on.
I'm sorry you have such a pessimistic interpretation of everyone's words.
I'm sorry you chose to take my original post and respond with a childish insult at my tournament skills.
I'm sorry this is what an honest discussion has devolved into.
I'm sorry you chose to ignore the entire content of my last post and instead throw out yet another childish statement.

Look, I agree with Pirul. Events in Trammel are not T2A UO. So I have about as much interest in them as I would if we opened up a casino in Vesper where you could play Texas Hold'em silver coins. Or if you could recall to the Star Room and play a game of pong there, and the winner got a +20 kryss of power and a golden lute of barding.

IF the events didn't take players from the actual game world, and IF the prizes didn't leak into the actual game world, I don't think anyone would complain. If the winner of Capture the Flag got a purple neon sword that said "CTF WINNER WOOT!" that they could carry whenever they were in Tournament Trammel, I'd be fine with it. But when the come out of there and sell/trade their silver for items that were actually obtained according to the actual 1999 rules of UO, we have a problem.

So this is what you're so mad about? You think I'm making childish statements about your inability to win tournaments? I am the absolute worst PvPer.

Wow, way to overpersonalize and completely miss the point. How absurd.

I think you're just the type of person who needs external enemies and things to blame rather than opportunities.