Combat changes needed (Archery)

[MatronDeWinter]

Who said archery damage did not account for tactics?

[nightshark]

... lol

Does this explaion why archery damage on the production shard sucks so bad?

you play an archer with no tactics on live server?

anatomy and tactics give the same bonus for archery as they do for melee weapons

[lotus39]

... lol

Does this explaion why archery damage on the production shard sucks so bad?

you play an archer with no tactics on live server?

anatomy and tactics give the same bonus for archery as they do for melee weapons

I could swear I read somewhere it doesnt, looks like I got some bad info

Welp off to macro tactics

[Derrick]

I could swear I read somewhere it doesnt, looks like I got some bad info
Welp off to macro tactics

This has been a not very uncommon misconception; I think rooted in the fact that an "accurate" ranged weapon gives a bonus to the weapon skill rather than to tactics; I believe this is a hold over from early pre-T2A as most of the major changes to weapons in 1998 and 1999 were only to melee weapons, and ranged weapons remained unchanged including this. Tactics does apply to all physical weapon damage though, both melee and ranged.

[Eaglestaff]

I was going to test the accuracy of this on the demo but I couldn't get it to work. Ive noticed on test center that if you fire a bow shot at someone while they are in range and then they move out of range before the damage applies the shot always misses. Is this accurate? Also, if they move out of range when the shot is fired and then they move back within range you dont do the the rapid fire phantom arrows thing, it just wastes the shot with no chance of hitting. Is this era accurate?

[Derrick]

I was going to test the accuracy of this on the demo but I couldn't get it to work. Ive noticed on test center that if you fire a bow shot at someone while they are in range and then they move out of range before the damage applies the shot always misses. Is this accurate? Also, if they move out of range when the shot is fired and then they move back within range you dont do the the rapid fire phantom arrows thing, it just wastes the shot with no chance of hitting. Is this era accurate?

The code we are using for archery is the OSI code without modification, it's belived to be 100% accurate to era; but I encourage anyone with doubt to look for any indication that archery changed at all (outside of damage changes, and the change from Dex to Stam based speeds) between June 1998 and Nov 1999. We've found no indication archery was modified at all but I'm open and welcoming to the possibility we're wrong.

[Batlin]

I was going to test the accuracy of this on the demo but I couldn't get it to work

Refer to the following post on JoinUO to make it work: http://forum.joinuo.com/viewtopic.php?f=32&t=574PM me if you did all steps there and it still doesn't work.

[Matt]

I was going to test the accuracy of this on the demo but I couldn't get it to work. Ive noticed on test center that if you fire a bow shot at someone while they are in range and then they move out of range before the damage applies the shot always misses. Is this accurate? Also, if they move out of range when the shot is fired and then they move back within range you dont do the the rapid fire phantom arrows thing, it just wastes the shot with no chance of hitting. Is this era accurate?

The code we are using for archery is the OSI code without modification, it's belived to be 100% accurate to era; but I encourage anyone with doubt to look for any indication that archery changed at all (outside of damage changes, and the change from Dex to Stam based speeds) between June 1998 and Nov 1999. We've found no indication archery was modified at all but I'm open and welcoming to the possibility we're wrong.

ugh. I know I'm sounding like a broken record here (with my active Qstaff thread) but archery just got made so much less effective and I don't believe it's accurate. I don't remember ever shooting this slow, the hit delay being this long or not being able to run right after you shoot. Today I was messing around with an archer/mage on my archer dexer and he appeared to be shooting the heavy xbow as fast as I was shooting the bow. And one time I waited a full six seconds before shooting him at near-full stamina. But as you mentioned before there may be a problem with all combat weapons that needs to be fixed.

[Derrick]

Between a small bug that was found in the implementation of the "no swing advance while moving", and the lag that was plaguing us until this morning, prior experimentation may be outdated. Can you update us on how weapons are operating now? Both Ranges and the other issue you raised regarding quarterstaff's?

Thanks!!

[Iced Earth]

Archery is working as I remember it back then. (For a 100 dex, anat, tactics guy)

You always had to stop and fully watch the animation and damage report before you could move, BUT at least it was across the screen AND it takes out big chunks of their health.

The Bow shoots pretty nice and fast at 100 dex as I remember it as well.

The changes to archery are Superb.

All of the changes are, really. I still wish that you could truly Swing on the Run (You still have to stop moving to some degree in order to swing your weapon at someone, although the timer to swing recharges while running now which is great.) It would be nice if the swing registered with no delay right when you moved into range. May not be era accurate though, but it's smoother. Ovefall though? Excellent. UOSA has easily become the PvPers Shard after this patch and the mount fatigue patch.

Work out what little kinks are left and send out a load of mailers letting people know how awesome the mechanics are now. Fun, fun stuff guys.

[Faust]

Surprised to see you venture over this way Iced...

[potamus]

Archery is working as I remember it back then. (For a 100 dex, anat, tactics guy)

You always had to stop and fully watch the animation and damage report before you could move, BUT at least it was across the screen AND it takes out big chunks of their health.

The Bow shoots pretty nice and fast at 100 dex as I remember it as well.

The changes to archery are Superb.

All of the changes are, really. I still wish that you could truly Swing on the Run (You still have to stop moving to some degree in order to swing your weapon at someone, although the timer to swing recharges while running now which is great.) It would be nice if the swing registered with no delay right when you moved into range. May not be era accurate though, but it's smoother. Ovefall though? Excellent. UOSA has easily become the PvPers Shard after this patch and the mount fatigue patch.

Work out what little kinks are left and send out a load of mailers letting people know how awesome the mechanics are now. Fun, fun stuff guys.

Agreed. My computer is a clunker and I have never been able to field on this shard because of that. With these new changes I am able to keep up on the field with my crappy computer. Players still often out run me but with the combat changes, it forces them to stay within a certain range; and with mount fatigue I easily keep up. However I am still very choppy and lag behind towers and certain areas of cities. Other then that I am having more fun then ever in the last two years of playing UOSA.

[Matt]

Between a small bug that was found in the implementation of the "no swing advance while moving", and the lag that was plaguing us until this morning, prior experimentation may be outdated. Can you update us on how weapons are operating now? Both Ranges and the other issue you raised regarding quarterstaff's?

Thanks!!

Archery bug:

again, all you have to do is run a few tiles away (NOT off the screen or out of spell-casting range) when the archer shoots and you avoid being hit 100% of the time. Not working right.

Qstaff and weapons in general:

I made a post in the Qstaff thread about how I still think it isn't swinging correctly. I had a brand new GM qstaff and some joker on foot attacked my murderer who was a good 5 screens away from the guard zone. Well, to my embarrassment and to the laughter of my UO pals I was surrounded by, he made it all the way to the guard zone without being dropped. He did not cast heal or drink any pots, nor did his health go up from applying bandages. I blocked his path several times, stopping both me and him, but to no success. As a person who was addicted to UO during, before and after this era, I noticed almost every little change and I assure you that something is off. I've swung that stick as much as anyone.

While we're talking about combat in general, I want to smash my point home that something is severly wrong. It is my opinion that this patch represents the phasing out the pure warrior and I don't think I'm being overly-dramatic. This is the era where there were much more than just Hally mages who had success. A skilled dexer against even the most skilled mage was often a coin toss or a wash-- yet this server seems to only look through the narrow lens of how the Hally mage can benifit further from certain patches, thereby undercutting those who are the greatest threats to the Hally mage. Archery, for example, is completely gimped beyond all recognition. It's as valuable in PVP as, say, tailoring. Before this patch was implimented combat was more authentic. Unless this whole weapons issue is revamped, I predict only Hally mages to have success- which was not the case back then.

[Iced Earth]

Man, I hope you are in the minority. Combat now is wayyyy better.

I play mostly warriors, mage on occasion. I can say now that my favorite template, the Archer Fencer, is gonna have a lot more success with archery functioning this way. Everything is just much much better. I am excited about it and I hope that word gets around that this place has fun mechanics.

[Matt]

Man, I hope you are in the minority. Combat now is wayyyy better.

I play mostly warriors, mage on occasion. I can say now that my favorite template, the Archer Fencer, is gonna have a lot more success with archery functioning this way. Everything is just much much better. I am excited about it and I hope that word gets around that this place has fun mechanics.

good luck!

I'd rather have the old combat system and 80 archery than the one that's being used now with GM archery. You will see why in time.