Motion to strike town add ons for Kingdom of Ascalon

[BlackFoot]

Sure, it's easy to hold these little chicken fights, or crafting matches, but try and run a PvP tourney when their are so few pvpers/duelers left on the shard, and see what the outcome of that turns out to be.

Aye player ran pvp events are nightmares to run, I have held a fair share of them plus ctf/warrior/pvp leagues etc. They are 100x more difficult to run purely beacuse of the type of players they attract. exceptions of course.
Pvpers in general tend to be less patient, less appreciative, and more competitive. Automated events give them everything they want which is completley understandable. The Pvpers who say 'Thank you for running this' are 9/10 times the same players who show up to the pvm/crafter/novelty events.

In comparison there are really no automated events for people other than pvpers (a couple survivals and a couple bag balls a week) which is really where the player community has a large opportunity to step in. Admin also have shown nothing but enthusiasm and cooperation with anyone trying to organize player ran events.

[Wise]

Why does no one ever see these 8 members? Infact, in the past like three+ months the only member of $$$ i've seen ingame was Marfu.. and that was when I was walking around ice isle, and saw him recall in hide and start mining. I see K^A everyday, in their town... dungeons.. etc.... Wheres $$$?

$$$ is a merchant guild, you don't see us because we craft in our houses, stay hidden at banks, Mining, stocking vendors, or Fishing...

None of these are very public activities, just because we are not running around killing blues, griefing, PvMing on our crafters & bank thieving does not mean we are not around, in general being a merchant is often the primary roll of our members, most if not all have alts who do some of the more exciting things in UO, in fact we have several members who run very Active RP guilds (I wont divulge who or what guilds for the sake of RP)


The point is we earned our mini town/merchant tower the shard voted a whopping 90% FOR our add-on, and we continued to run events after we got them.

Hell I don't even see most of my guildies in game, please join us in IRC that's where the real deals go down, $$$ expands and shrinks like all guilds in regards to new players, but we have retained a core group of 6 - 8 players the past 10 months some even longer, thats more that can be said for almost any guild here on secondage.

and for your amusement, I will list our active members. (in no particular order)


Theograd[Owner of Yew Vendors, $$$ Smith, Boycraft & Kegs]
Wise[GM & General merchant - Inscription]
Pristiq [Lumber Jack & Bulk Wood sales]
Bruels [Fisherman, general merchant]
Drazaos [Bows, General merchant]
Myre [new Player]
Tabius [Founder and Former GM]
Marfu [My right hand man!]
Kryptonical [Property Merchant]



I have talked to all these people within the last 7 Days, we a very active guild, EITHER WAY this is not a Debate about how active $$$ is but rather the fact that there are to many INACTIVE guilds....


I plan to compile a Thread with the Names, Locations & Screenshots of these Ghost Guild towns and their add-ons, keep your eyes pealed!

[BlackFoot]

the $$$ vendor tent and docks there are awesomes
I would feel bad if they ever were gone, been a favourite priate spot at the docks ther efor long time lol

thats one of those things unique to uosa i would really miss

[Cataclyst]

Thats great that you can name your active guildmates, I'm sure every guild can do the same. Infact I've seen well over 9 K^A Members... at a given time I've been attacked by about 9-10 of them.

Just because people don't run events with their town, like I said, doesn't mean they are inactive. I'm sorry they don't play to the liking of your playstyle, by sitting in their house crafting, or running RP guilds. They PvP. They are active PvPers(well, Pkers). They affect the community more than $$$ in my dealings with them.

They keep farmers under control, and provide loot for whoever kills them. No, I'm not just hating on $$$, just the fact that you think your guild pretty much deserves their addons, while no one elses does.


From the T^B stone that we NO LONGER have access to, I can name quite a few active players off it.

http://my.uosecondage.com/Status/Player/4184
http://my.uosecondage.com/Status/Player/8379
http://my.uosecondage.com/Status/Player/18767
http://my.uosecondage.com/Status/Player/16999
http://my.uosecondage.com/Status/Player/28036
http://my.uosecondage.com/Status/Player/24633

From the war stone, we have

http://my.uosecondage.com/Status/Player/50506
http://my.uosecondage.com/Status/Player/28004
http://my.uosecondage.com/Status/Player/32318

*both Gold & Lite are still in "TB". They just aren't around when Eulogy normally gets on.

[Wise]

Cataclyst.... serious? have you basically ignored this whole thread and any relevant discussion regarding town add-ons?.... Having an active guild is NOT what grants you town add-ons... and my post was simply replying to you about our active members.

AGAIN we shall quote the Town add-on Guide... two posts I feel are quite relevant and some of the most important

3. The main purpose of player towns is to promote active communities and create activity in different areas of our world. This is the key element to obtaining any special add-ons to your city. This means you will need to promote your guild within the community with things such as events, quests, fight nights, anything that will spread your guilds name in a positive way within second age. Because in the end it will be your co-players choice whether or not you get add-ons.

Do I need to post all of our events past, and present again? I cant say I even remember seeing any other guild host an event in the past 2 months or so (and no resist sessions are not events, they are macro orgies)

-Your town will need to stay maintained(active) in order to prevent any upkeep costs for repairs. In other words, if your add-ons decay due to inactivity, they will need to be payed in full to be repaired.

These guidelines are subject to change at any time. Staff will still reserve the final say on any decision regarding a guild town receiving any improvements.

Show up to the $$$ tower for 10 minutes and count the players who travel through there, foot traffic alone has made this a active area in the community via vendors & runetower, but since we got our town add ons 10 months ago we have held DOZENS of events. more then I can say about most guilds post-addons...

why don't you try and pick on a guild which actually doesn't deserve what they have & cant back it time after time, with events, Activity & community support.... not to mention that $$$ pays for the only public UOSA ventrillo server.


Now my question for you is, why does a 'Active' guild like T^B deserve their town add-ons when they cant event keep control of their guild stone? its fairly obvious just from your last post that T^B is not even a 'guild' in the sense of the word, your guilds are spread across 2 guild stones, likely live in all parts of the world, and NOTHING goes on at the T^B town... not in the past 8 months at least, frankly why do a bunch of PvPers who don't host events deserve anything over well... any other guild?

[ehafh]

Why does no one ever see these 8 members? Infact, in the past like three+ months the only member of $$$ i've seen ingame was Marfu.. and that was when I was walking around ice isle, and saw him recall in hide and start mining. I see K^A everyday, in their town... dungeons.. etc.... Wheres $$$?

$$$ is a merchant guild, you don't see us because we craft in our houses, stay hidden at banks, Mining, stocking vendors, or Fishing...

None of these are very public activities, just because we are not running around killing blues, griefing, PvMing on our crafters & bank thieving does not mean we are not around, in general being a merchant is often the primary roll of our members, most if not all have alts who do some of the more exciting things in UO, in fact we have several members who run very Active RP guilds (I wont divulge who or what guilds for the sake of RP)

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i don't trust wise. he's passive aggressive on the forums, and a merchant. the guy is far from being an innocent player helper, although masquerading as such.
essentially you play the game to make money. to make other players spend more time doing what's necessary because you got to the finish line first.
all your prices are 30% higher than other vendors because you play every day, and they are "stocked". wow man, way to help out the community!
it's kind of lame to see vendors with special trammel tents in my opinion, they detract from exploration of the realm. people figure ok i'll just buy
from this overpriced renowned shop and be safe. how does that give back to the community? cool, players logged on for 30 seconds to over pay, then over farm later.
oh the irony of you trying to abolish a rival guilds trammel setup.


in my opinion, you're not special. we both play the same game. get rid of all the trammel addons.

[BlackFoot]

it's kind of lame to see vendors with special trammel tents in my opinion, they detract from exploration of the realm.

i feel the exact opposite of that

[Brules]

3. The main purpose of player towns is to promote active communities and create activity in different areas of our world. This is the key element to obtaining any special add-ons to your city. This means you will need to promote your guild within the community with things such as events, quests, fight nights, anything that will spread your guilds name in a positive way

Simply put, being an active PvP Pk guild does not fullfill the above requirements.

I say if your guild town is inactive and unused, the add ons should decay and rot away just like your inactive guild/town.

I also say, it would be great to see more guilds pursue add ons, it seems UOSA is in a serious glut for player run events etc. UoH and $$$ seem to be the only ones doing much of anything.

PS - Using your *town* status to lure people in to PK them should merit instant deletion of all add ons. I was out exploring the player towns when I first started here a few months ago and was Pk'd at K^A by their members for nothing more than simply being there. Way to promote the community!

[Pro]

active pk guild = anti's around your town constantly.

[Downs]

The policy has been made to make it a community decision to grant add-ons, does it work in reverse too (honest question to staff)?

You can argue all you want about what you do and why you deserve them, but if staff decides it comes down to the community, then it's that magic community opinion that matters.

[Brules]

-Your town will need to stay maintained(active) in order to prevent any upkeep costs for repairs. In other words, if your add-ons decay due to inactivity, they will need to be payed in full to be repaired.

Seems pretty clear cut to me....

[Downs]

-Your town will need to stay maintained(active) in order to prevent any upkeep costs for repairs. In other words, if your add-ons decay due to inactivity, they will need to be payed in full to be repaired.

you're right, it does

[Wise]

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i don't trust wise. he's passive aggressive on the forums, and a merchant. the guy is far from being an innocent player helper, although masquerading as such.
essentially


it's kind of lame to see vendors with special trammel tents in my opinion, they detract from exploration of the realm.

I would like to know where your getting your information? not to mention how long you have 'known' me so well....

I am aggressive on the forums, its the forum, since I dont pvp in game, or anything of that sort I have to be a FORUM WARRIOR! RAWR!... but that doesn't mean I don't help new players.... I love to see UOSA growth, and give away tones of gold to new players at the $$$ all the time, not to mention give away free stuff when ever anyone asks me in game for something...

you play the game to make money. to make other players spend more time doing what's necessary because you got to the finish line first.
all your prices are 30% higher than other vendors because you play every day, and they are "stocked". wow man, way to help out the community!

This is so far from the truth, I have money, I made it a year ago when i was playing here PvMing Farming gold, hunting and all that sorts, not I play for the player interactions, I could be breaking even and it wouldn't matter to me.... I would also like to see where you get your '30%' higher stats? we have been selling goods at $$$ tower for relatively the same price for 10 months, we check other vendors for competitive rates and yet we still sell out, I have REFUSED to raise my prices despite demand, I could EASLY be selling spell books for 7 - 8k each, and Armour for 2k and Bows for 1k and all that junk, but we dont (which is very un-merchant like actually) Just recently I opened a vendor near Bigouds which have higher prices then my $$$ vendor (still lower then bigoud to keep things competitive) and the product still sells faster then I can stock it... Frankly Vendors are a Help to the community by NOT making other players spend more time doing what's necessary (crafting their own wares)

people figure ok i'll just buy
from this overpriced renowned shop and be safe. how does that give back to the community? cool, players logged on for 30 seconds to over pay, then over farm later.
oh the irony of you trying to abolish a rival guilds trammel setup.

in my opinion, you're not special. we both play the same game. get rid of all the trammel addons.

So players buy my spell books and items so they dont get ripped off by sketchy vendors? I am pretty sure this is a service to the community, do you know how many players I have talked to that buy spell books for 5k - 7k off vendors only to find out they are empty? your argument has so many holes its not even funny, I can't believe players can actually think that $$$ does nothing for the community of UOSA....

And frankly I Love the idea of Town-addons and in no way am I trying to abolish them, and even more hilarious is the notion that TB, K^A or any other guild is a rival for $$$, there is room for so many more quality vendors on UOSA that I don't think it would event effect demand. this just shows that you don't know me, or the $$$ guild very well, and are making random accusations to only try and slander our reputation even more....

Blackfoot its hard being on top eh? everyone wants to push you off and take your throne


better arguments plz

-Your town will need to stay maintained(active) in order to prevent any upkeep costs for repairs. In other words, if your add-ons decay due to inactivity, they will need to be payed in full to be repaired.

you're right, it does

I agree, this has come up many times before and there have been more then one poll for guilds to loose their add-ons, none of which have resulted in any decay in their town, I support this method, though it would have to be limited to a once a month or every few months to stop Felix from spamming guild town closures weekly!

[Cataclyst]

Editttt: Just a note, TB, K^A, mYm, and TG are all considered ACTIVE PvP guilds, the rest.. aren't active at all, other than the Urks.


Why forcing PvP guilds to run events for their player towns is unfair.

1.Money
We all know, PvPers normally aren't rich people. PvPers give to the community, whether you like to admit to it or not. We buy your weapons that you craft, we buy your overpriced bulk reagents. Being an active PvPer, and having money to give 100-200k worth of prizes out, doesn't fit in with most pvpers "budget".

2.Community Size
If you've noticed, PvPers are a minority on this shard. For every 30 farmers/crafters/thieves/macroers, you'll have maybe one pvper. Given there are normally 400~ unique IP's on, that leaves you roughly 13 PvPers on at any given time. Try and run one of your events for 13 people, and tell me how that is giving to the community. It's no secret that running and organizing a PvP type event is 100 times harder than a chicken fight, or other similar things.

3. The main purpose of player towns is to promote active communities and create activity in different areas of our world. This is the key element to obtaining any special add-ons to your city. This means you will need to promote your guild within the community with things such as events, quests, fight nights, anything that will spread your guilds name in a positive way within second age. Because in the end it will be your co-players choice whether or not you get add-ons.

3.No where does it say "In order to have a guild town you MUST run events". PvP guilds are constantly fighting in their town. Lots of fights happen in TB, I'm sorry you're not there to see them? Every guild can also attest to fighting always happening in mYm town, as well as TG town. If TG asked for addons, for that reason alone I'd vote Yes to them getting them, even though I do not care for them.

Also, can make a nice little point off this line alone

anything that will spread your guilds name in a positive way within second age

Sure, $$$ is known for running events. But what you're known for more than anything, is your overpriced goods. If you consider that to be a positive thing to players, or even the community, then I guess we're all just idiots and jealous of $$$.



also, to wise on your question/statement about TB, we still own the entire town minus a couple house spots, all of the members I pointed out above live inside the town still, but also have houses in other places.


More later when I care more!~

[BlackFoot]

aye, personal attacks dont further either side of the discussion. I dont see how the price of arrows at a vendor somehow apply to the town blessing debate

From a personal experience as aplayer on Great Lakes I remember I came across Red Devils for the first time. That was awesome. That did nothing but add to my experience as a UO player. Its very similar to the $$$ tower and vendor tent. Finding these places for the first time in game adds interest to a players day if nothing else.